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An interview with Vernon Grounds

From his spacious office in the heart of learning Vernon Grounds Denver Seminary he exudes warmth, so graceful, deep spiritual and humble spirit that endeared this man to thousands of former students, colleagues, counselees, and participants numerous seminars and church services. His office is filled with thousands of books and decorated with a huge collection of canes and walking sticks, most of which came as gifts from friends and admirers who have added to its unique collection over the decades. But Vernon Reasons not to rely on one Despite of his age. His health was excellent, her gait is steady, his mind is sharp and his sense of humor is relentless. Her conversation is warm, and affirming without even a hint of self-promotion. More than anything else, it forms the leadership at the beginning of Denver Seminary, where today it is Chancellor. Several years ago, this man proposed to a young college professor named Gary Collins that he should consider teaching in a School of Theology. This conversation has changed the direction of my career. When the two of us met for this interview on a winter morning, Dr. Grounds suggested he should go to the school cafeteria for a hot soup so that we can talk over lunch in his office. In this context relaxed, we had the following conversation.

How do you interested in Christian counseling?

VG: I was pastor and discovered that the training seminar that I had suffered didn't give me the means to be very useful in the treatment problems and people. I decided to pursue a Ph.D. at Drew University, which was only about 25 miles. I started there, and it was very exciting. little credit has been givens € "I think a few years credita € "for the work I had done to the faith Theological Seminary. The faith has been regarded as an institution not approved and probably does not work on a high enough academic level. That meant I had to take makeup courses in many different types. Somewhere along the line, as I hoped Id find useful information for dealing with people's problems, so I took some courses in counseling. At that time, I more interested in the relationship between psychological theory and Christian faith. I submitted myself to a huge amount of reading people, so well known in the fields of counseling and psychology, and have focused my attention on what they had to say about love. Then I am here Denver Johnson City, New York, where I was at the Bible Baptist Seminary, while I finished my classes at Drew and began a thesis. Without any control and without going back to consult with faculty, I hit about 800 pages on the concept of love in psychology modern. My mentor thought it was good things, but the review panel felt that I was too ambitious and I needed to focus on a subject and do some intensive study, rather

that seeks to cover the whole vast area of the concept of love in modern psychology. Here in Denver, the seminar has been experiencing great difficulties and I found myself as administrative agent. I was Dean, elevated to that position from the start by any desire of mine, but simply because of a lack of leadership to others. It was a very difficult time, since I am the voice of the seminar, travel between the churches, responding to criticisms that were being directed against us as an alleged neo-evangelical seminary, and teaching at least 12 hours per quarter.

Today I look back and wonder how it was done. I remember the elephants dance, which he was told that wasn't wonder how this has been done but this has been done at all. I had this feeling, but I continued. Eventually I was able to take quarter turned off and do a thesis on the concept of love in the psychology of Sigmund Freud. This was agreed to Drew. I went back, not having been on campus or consultations with

faculty, but I managed to defend adequately, I been awarded a doctorate. Much of what I've described above was motivated by my pastoral experience. I realized how I was unprepared. Thats what originally motivated me to do the PhD program, but I didn't find much help concrete in theoretical studies that I wore on. When I had the opportunity here at the seminary, I introduced a course in pastoral which was really a course in Pastoral Counseling, to help our students (at that time almost entirely of men) to have an idea how they could relate with people, listen to people, and perhaps wisely and biblically offer some guidelines. Later I became chairman of the seminar (which was by default, no one else would accept the job) and it means a very busy life. From my point of view today, I look back and see how it was done. Thanks to the Gods of empowerment. I think it was in 1973 when I asked faculty whether we could present a master's counseling program. The reaction has not been fully enthusiastic. There was a feeling that counseling by itself, as a specialized discipline, would not be the task of an Evangelical Seminary. However, the majority of the faculty

voted that we undertake this new program, and we did. Thus, staggering, we have some time later, Beck asked Jim to join us, and in time he assumed leadership of the counseling program. Under his leadership, it has really flourished. We have had one of those situations where students were increasingly applying for admission to this program, including an influx of students women. According to Jim Beck, he became a very strong program and offers, I think, an excellent training.

Now, my big concern is that boards not only remain but the Christian Bible. If its in Scripture, we must keep in mind. We recognize that some graduate degrees and then Graduate elsewhere, and a number of them have become professional psychologists and even psychiatrists. But I repeat My big concern is that any Christian orientation, we are oriented toward biblical truth and we recognize that we serve the Spirit of thanks the gods and the gods and the truth is mediation.

Many Christians can be Christian counselors, but how do they apply biblical truth in secular circles?

VG: With great difficulty. Sometimes, of whats been reported to me by these individuals personally, they used Christian principles, without labeling them as such. This way theyve been â € œundercover agentsâ € … I am not saying â € € œsmuggling ina Gods truth, but it boils down to something like that. As I look back, there Where were those people seeking a position said right from shoulder they can give advice, but nothing of a point Christian worldview. Ive been really impressed by Larry Crabb most recent insistence that if were going to do biblical counseling, we hopefully can do in a typically Christian fellowship. From my point of view, because I am interested at this stage of my career in consulting Bible, the book Gary Collins entitled Biblical Foundations of Christian Counseling for People Helpers is this kind of approach I would like to host.

You have a reputation for being an eloquent speaker, God has gifted in this area. You've written articles, but you havent focused on writing books.

VG: No, and I'm very ambivalent about this. I wonder if I come to my deathbed and I'm still conscious, so there will be a tension strong regret that I didn't write at least several pounds. On the other hand, as a kind of rationalization, I tell myself sometimes that other interrogators've chosen to write on tablets of flesh in human hearts. And this I know I did. Ive spent an excessive amount of time with individualsâ € "not only one hour at a time in a counseling center, but with students and Christians and others. However, it is imperative that those who can write and are motivated to do so should be some respectable literature. Has anyone in our area largely Evangelical proved books throughout the profession â € "lay or OTHERWISE €" recognizes and applauds? William Barclay said that we need specialists high level, we applaud, but we need the extension of intermediate level, which can take the seminal thought and make it accessible. (I not know what the third level or lower would be). The whole area of Christian publication is open, it seems, to some criticism. If anything, its more popular than in the past. Its aimed at a large number of concrete issues. We now have all sorts of materials on gender, on sex relationships, family. Women's studies have also proliferated almost at an astonishing pace. But necessary. I must confess that I regret at least not dislodged two or three books which I think could be of some use to the Church in general.

But you have had a significant impact in terms of lives you've touched, and which also becomes important. Tell me about your local council.

VG: Several years ago at the suggestion of a friend, we started the Vernon Grounds Counseling Center as an independent. This is a suite of offices approximately one mile from the seminar. When I counsel, I often use one of these offices. The others are leased to other consultants. I do not too many people, people perhaps eight or ten a week.

We have a client with a Christian majority. I do not specialize. I see the usual range relational and emotional difficulties. I do not pretend to be a professional psychiatrist. What I do is more pastoral than the board of professional advice. Then here, on campus, I'm on hand for the old, visitors, and the family of the seminar. I have a weekly meeting with a couple of professional lawyers and every Tuesday I met a group of people. This is not counseling, per se. It is mentoring.

Your activities are limited not to counseling and mentoring. Arent you the chancellor seminar?

VG: Its an empty title. Really. When Haddon Robinson (former President) left the Council decided it did not want to have an interim president, so for some reason, they told me asked to serve as chancellor. It rather amused me, because I asked, â € œWell, what the Chancellor do?

€ Whats its function? R and nobody could tell me!

One side more staff, we talk about your family.

VG: On June 17, 1999, Ann and I celebrated our 60th wedding anniversary. On July 19, I became 85 Anns 85th anniversary was few weeks later. We have a daughter, Barbara Owen, who plays the role of receptionist at the center of the board. She and her husband also have

girl who is now married. I come to the office every day when I see a procession of people coming by. I still have a significant amount of preaching in churches as pulpit supply needs. I still travel a bit, and the seminar also allows me to teach. This summer, I give a one-week course on the life and thought of CS Lewis. During the school year, Ill teach a course on ethics and the other Christian

worldview and its contemporary rivals.

How do you keep strong?

VG: I do a lot of reading in a number of areas. Many books that I skimmed the contents, but I have a wide range My great concern is that any Christian orientation, we are oriented toward biblical truth and recognize that we serve the Spirit. Teaching takes me too strong, and Of course, there is also interaction with colleagues and young people. Who knows how long I must continue in the ministry? I can not be grateful enough health and strength, I think, still a measure of mental acuity. People often ask me, â € Oedo you have a secret? Â € I believe I can attributed to the grace, genes, and gym, because I still go to the gym three times a week and try to stay at least moderately fit physics. Other than that, its simple grace. As I drive over to the house in the morning, I must say. Thank you, Lord, that I can continue to function, I can still See and hear and be part of the Christian faith in progress.

As you continue to have a ministry, do you have any specific goals or plans for the future?

VG: It would difficult for me to say what my goals are other than the survival and continuation of activities. I want to continue, I hope in this situation for at least another couple of years.

What about goals for the profession? Where do you think of this area of the Christian Council should go?

VG: Well, probably I've already suggested that I hope much more than the integration will be carried out. Hopefully there will be a strong biblical emphasis and future counselors (more than in the past) will be able to share the grace of God and the divine truth with their customers. I hope others will be made by evangelicals on recent discoveries of science and personology of our faith. I would hope that we can interact with the new currents of thought in our society, not only to apologize, creatively. I was with Armand Nicolai recently at Harvard. I met Armand when he was a high school student, and he has publicly referred to this issue on several occasions. Take the help of a therapist phone.

We talked together, him and me, and I asked him to go into psychology, because we need in this field are competent, who have an excellent background as a supporter of secularism, but evangelicals are committed. He has So go in psychiatry, hes and edited a book of psychiatry at Harvard. Each year at Harvard, they have a series of conferences that have been presented some outstanding people. This year, Armand has lectured. They are now out, has attracted much attention, and were him an opportunity to discuss and contrast of Sigmund Freud and CS Lewis in their worldviews, ways of their ethics, it is to help people cope with life and death. If we had more people of this stature, capable of articulating a Christian stand point of view largely psychological, Christian counseling will a significant contribution.

About the Author

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